Dont agree Shalam mate. The SU-85b is awesome to me, and a million miles better than the 85 ( heck, I like it more than my Stug III). Granted im playing a stock 85 - its slow, cumbersome, takes an hour to turn and has a shit gun, but faced with the xp I'd need to upgrade it compared to just grinding to the next in line, I'm just biting the bullet and ploughing on through. I'll probably keep the SU-85 and fully upgrade it at some point, but I am assured that even with the best engine its still a hippo. My whole game is based on keeping away from the enemy at all costs - my TDs have no armour so I have to. The suped up SU-85B is wicked fast, turns on a sixpence and has great damage with the 85mm lb2s. I just find the 85 to be like driving a bin waggon with a pop gun mounted on it. Thank god I only need 4000 xp or so to the SU-100 but I am told that its not a lot better than the 85?